How are colors boosted on different formats of MPI?

[80s Big Hair]

I assume that Magnum, P.I. was shot on film and know that film has a much longer shelf life than stuff put on tape. Black and white old movies or TV programs look excellent in HD, but the color movies and TV shows have problems with the color fading. This also happens with still photographs. I have family photos over a hundred years old that look very good, while the color pictures from the "modern era" fade fast.

DVD

Blu-ray

Note both were downloaded so they are more compressed than the actual discs. The colors are vibrant on the Blu-ray and mushy on the DVD. How is this achieved? I doubt that they actually restore the colors and probably replicate what the original might have looked like.

[Gorilla Mask]

Thank you! It actually convinced me to buy the blu-ray version.

I just can-t understand nothing to it, thus i've found some détail about this:

"Blu-ray VS DVD color space

The color space is another difference between DVD and Blu-ray. This is the reason why you can find Blu-ray disc with better video quality than DVD. Blu-ray color space is defined in Rec.709, which includes a set of colors that looks like a triangle. This is quite different from Rec.601 on DVD, which improves the way luminance has been defined as a ratio to RGB color. When you use Blu-ray discs for HDTV, color conversion occurs at the same time as resolution conversion occurs."

Sounds like Sanskri to me...

[Styles Bitchley]

Whatever the process it sure looks good!

[Mad Kudu Buck]

I prefer faded colours on older shows. I've found that when colours are enhanced (the annoying term "make colours pop!") it destroys the feeling I had when originally viewing it back in the original time period. It never looked like that - even on the latest colour TVs at the time.

Though I usually do like the improved resolution and detail, the "popping" colours ruin the feeling for me. I have to desaturate colours for it to look right to me.

[Pahonu]

MPI’s original colors on the Panaflex film they used would have been feature film quality like the Blu-ray. Most films used the same camera, unless they went big for Super70 or the like. We just never got to see it on the TV’s of the era. I REALLY don’t like colorized or pan-and scan films, and avoid them for the original formats. That said, I’m not sure what I think here. I still have rather small televisions compared to many, and don’t get overly picky about the image quality or size. Still, I’m fairly certain that even when playing the standard DVD’s, the picture is better quality than the analog broadcasts on those old tube TV’s.

[80s Big Hair]

Mad Buck Kudo I can understand the nostalgia aspect of watching them as you originally did, but for me that would involve watching a lot of them on a 12 inch black and white TV as my family did not have a color TV until the mid 1980s. As Pahonu confirmed they were shot on film so the originals were much better looking than what the best TVs of the time could display. In my mind I would prefer to see it as close to possible to the film. But to each his own. Both are valid approaches.

And Pahonu I also detest pan and scan to make it fit the TV aspect ratio. In fact I was miffed when the HD aspect ratio was not the same as movies. It turned out not to be a big deal as I hardly notice because the blacks on HD TVs are really black so I do not really notice the letter boxing. As to colorization I am with you 100% regarding things shot in black and white. This is because with black and white the contrast is jacked way up and it just looks weird when colored. More importantly to me it was not intended to look that way. As you implied correcting the color of faded things shot in color is an entirely different issue. It will never look like what the original film looked liked and there is the danger of over correcting it to make it look cartoonish (which apparently is not a word). As far as I can tell it is largely guess work.

All that said, I am not overly particular and would not mind watching a good show on a 12 inch black and white CRT TV like I did growing up. Heck I do not even own a TV larger than 21 inches.

[Pahonu]

Mad Buck Kudo I can understand the nostalgia aspect of watching them as you originally did, but for me that would involve watching a lot of them on a 12 inch black and white TV as my family did not have a color TV until the mid 1980s. As Pahonu confirmed they were shot on film so the originals were much better looking than what the best TVs of the time could display. In my mind I would prefer to see it as close to possible to the film. But to each his own. Both are valid approaches.

And Pahonu I also detest pan and scan to make it fit the TV aspect ratio. In fact I was miffed when the HD aspect ratio was not the same as movies. It turned out not to be a big deal as I hardly notice because the blacks on HD TVs are really black so I do not really notice the letter boxing. As to colorization I am with you 100% regarding things shot in black and white. This is because with black and white the contrast is jacked way up and it just looks weird when colored. More importantly to me it was not intended to look that way. As you implied correcting the color of faded things shot in color is an entirely different issue. It will never look like what the original film looked liked and there is the danger of over correcting it to make it look cartoonish (which apparently is not a word). As far as I can tell it is largely guess work.

All that said, I am not overly particular and would not mind watching a good show on a 12 inch black and white CRT TV like I did growing up. Heck I do not even own a TV larger than 21 inches.

I say cartoonish is a word!

Yes, I was definitely referring to colorized black and white films in my comments.

Until “film” cameras became digital, typically dramas were shot on film while sitcoms, game shows, talk shows, etc... were video taped. Some sitcoms did use film like Cheers which accounts for its greater contrast than most other sitcoms. The dark bar would not have been possible with the light needed for video tape. These filmed series were also edited on film, but in all cases, a video tape was delivered to local stations and network affiliates to be broadcast. That’s what we were seeing in the 80’s the video transfer in an analog broadcast, not the highest of quality to say the least.

[Mad Kudu Buck]

Mad Buck Kudo I can understand the nostalgia aspect of watching them as you originally did, but for me that would involve watching a lot of them on a 12 inch black and white TV as my family did not have a color TV until the mid 1980s. As Pahonu confirmed they were shot on film so the originals were much better looking than what the best TVs of the time could display. In my mind I would prefer to see it as close to possible to the film. But to each his own. Both are valid approaches.

I'm not saying I'd want it to look like old low-resolution TV, but that I don't like artificially enhanced colours. I'd want it to look as close to original film as possible. Film from that time period didn't have the super saturated colours of modern film. These days, they always over saturate colours (probably so people don't complain of "washed out colours" compared to modern shows), which makes old film look like modern film - and that ruins the feeling for me sometimes.

An example is a comparison between DVD and Blu-ray of "Space 1999" (first season only - I like to pretend season 2 doesn't exist). The Blu-ray is far too bright and the colours almost cartoonish. It totally destroys the dark scary atmosphere. To get that back, I have to increase contrast, lower brightness slightly and desaturate colours - to get it close to how the DVDs look.

If I got the Magnum Blu-ray, I'd probably have to slightly desaturate too.

[Pahonu]

Mad Buck Kudo I can understand the nostalgia aspect of watching them as you originally did, but for me that would involve watching a lot of them on a 12 inch black and white TV as my family did not have a color TV until the mid 1980s. As Pahonu confirmed they were shot on film so the originals were much better looking than what the best TVs of the time could display. In my mind I would prefer to see it as close to possible to the film. But to each his own. Both are valid approaches.

I'm not saying I'd want it to look like old low-resolution TV, but that I don't like artificially enhanced colours. I'd want it to look as close to original film as possible. Film from that time period didn't have the super saturated colours of modern film. These days, they always over saturate colours (probably so people don't complain of "washed out colours" compared to modern shows), which makes old film look like modern film - and that ruins the feeling for me sometimes.

An example is a comparison between DVD and Blu-ray of "Space 1999" (first season only - I like to pretend season 2 doesn't exist). The Blu-ray is far too bright and the colours almost cartoonish. It totally destroys the dark scary atmosphere. To get that back, I have to increase contrast, lower brightness slightly and desaturate colours - to get it close to how the DVDs look.

If I got the Magnum Blu-ray, I'd probably have to slightly desaturate too.

I’m on the same page regarding enhanced color saturation. An interesting thing to note is that early color film technology had the capability of pretty intense colors if enough light was used during filming. Think about 1939’s The Wizard of Oz and the deliberate contrast created between black and white Kansas and Technicolor Oz. It was made only a four years after the very first full color feature, Becky Sharp. That was an artistic choice and a brilliant one, but I think it shows us at least somewhat, that today’s color choices are preferences more than anything. The technology was largely there in the past but artistic choices likely played a role in more muted tones. Film Noir is probably the most extreme example of that. I read in a book my wife has that one of the difficulties in filming Wizard was the intense heat on the sets from the lighting used to get those brilliant colors. Perhaps that was also a factor in color choices of the era. Unfortunately, I don’t have any more details about how film technology improved or when, regarding the color/light requirements.

[Mad Kudu Buck]

Yes, early Technicolor had bright colours and bright lighting. I saw documentaries where they said that when the British used Technicolor, they tried to make more natural colours - and the makers of Technicolor weren't happy about it. They wanted super-bright colours.

But 70's/early 80's film is completely different - more muted and natural - and they faded differently. I could identify the year a movie was made by the fade of the film. 60's movies became yellowish, while 70's movies went light and brownish. These days, you can only see it in unrestored previews and old unrestored documentaries.

[Gorilla Mask]

Yes, early Technicolor had bright colours and bright lighting. I saw documentaries where they said that when the British used Technicolor, they tried to make more natural colours - and the makers of Technicolor weren't happy about it. They wanted super-bright colours.

But 70's/early 80's film is completely different - more muted and natural - and they faded differently. I could identify the year a movie was made by the fade of the film. 60's movies became yellowish, while 70's movies went light and brownish. These days, you can only see it in unrestored previews and old unrestored documentaries.

I've just watched an old Hollywood movie called 'Dive Bomber' (1941) starring Eroll Flynn. it was promoted as one of the first with full technicolor. The aerial views were amazing and the freshness of the colors just stunned me. I'm a bit of an expert on historic aircrafts and there... I was served. I had the impression that these scenes had been shot yesterday!

The plot is not of great interest, however...

https://www.google.com/search?q=dive+bo ... 20&bih=966

[Pahonu]

Interesting history of color photography, both still and motion pictures.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.provid ... ision/amp/

[ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan)]

Don't they always show the Superman I LOVE LUCY episode in color??? Ugghh! They also colorized the classic Christmas episode of THE ANDY GRIFFITH SHOW. I just can't watch LUCY or ANDY in color. Well, except for the last 3 seasons of ANDY.

Speaking of small B&W TV's... that's how I watched all the classic shows that I love from the 50s, 60s, 70s, and 80s. I watched them all on our little B&W TV. In the 90s! The poor guy served us well and I think we finally laid him to rest sometime around 2004 or 2005. Wish I still had him though. Oh, the nostalgia. Countless hours of Knight Rider, Five-O, A-Team, Airwolf, Three's Company, Andy Griffith, Gilligan, Bonanza, Lucy, Rockford, etc. The list goes on...

So I really can't be bothered if a pixel is out of place when I'm watching DVDs or Blu-Rays these days. Though I do agree that sometimes things can get too cleaned up, to the point where there is this fake sheen to it.

[Mad Kudu Buck]

.

[Pahonu]

Speaking of small B&W TV's... that's how I watched all the classic shows that I love from the 50s, 60s, 70s, and 80s. I watched them all on our little B&W TV. In the 90s! The poor guy served us well and I think we finally laid him to rest sometime around 2004 or 2005. Wish I still had him though. Oh, the nostalgia. Countless hours of Knight Rider, Five-O, A-Team, Airwolf, Three's Company, Andy Griffith, Gilligan, Bonanza, Lucy, Rockford, etc. The list goes on...

I've got a couple of these things:



They're great little TVs, my favourite portable B&W - 2" screen, made 1978. Ironically, I was testing the reception on this TV when I saw the NEW Magnum PI (I think episode 3), broadcast on the only remaining analogue TV station in my range. I watched it, but didn't bother tuning in the next week.


Here's my favourite non-portable B&W - 5" screen, also made 1978:

I had something similar on my sailboat... until analog broadcasting ended several years ago. Then it became a radio for my son.