Hawaii Five-O: Any Fans?

[Pahonu]

See? That's the thing. Raymond Burr???? Talk about an actor that could make you go comatose. The man sleep-walked through all his roles, whether it was PERRY MASON or IRONSIDE. Mike Connors got nominated for MANNIX too. I don't mind Connors or MANNIX but Lord ran circles around him. Same with Karl Malden on STREETS OF SAN FRANCISCO. He got nominated but he's laughable doing the "tough cop" routine. I really like the show and like him in it but when he was trying to rough up a suspect it was hilarious. He felt like a silly uncle trying to act tough. William Conrad was also nominated for CANNON. What was his gimmick? He was a fat private eye! Seriously, that's it.

The only guy who was in Lord's league (of playing the hard-edged "don't cross me" type) was Telly Savalas playing KOJAK. He actually got nominated and won. The other guys are a joke compared to Lord. Seriously, we can all have our opinions but if you're gonna nominate Connors, Conrad, Malden, Burr (SHUDDER!) then where the heck is Lord's nomination? You're seriously gonna tell me he didn't deserve it but those others did? His show was 10 times more popular and had higher ratings than its peers and as an actor he blew the others away. But hey, if your preference is watching Burr fumbling around in his wheelchair and delivering lines in such a flat manner as to make your eyes glaze over then he's the guy for you. I imagine they nominated him because he probably represented a special interest group - those in wheelchairs? As we all know Lord didn't play the Hollywood game and was not the easiest to get along with. He was a perfectionist every step of the way and being very private he didn't socialize much. I suppose he ruffled some feathers along the way (James Bond/Star Trek) and maybe his peers didn't care for him. But the fact that he was a damn good actor remains and the fact that he didn't get recognized for it is truly unfair! 12 seasons and not a single nomination? You know something isn't right. That's fine if the Emmy's preferred the likes of Peter Falk or James Garner (both fine actors in their roles) because their roles were more animated and quirky, but if that's the case then guys like Mike Connors or William Conrad or Raymond Burr shouldn't have been nominated either because they played those same straight-laced, no-nonsense types that Lord did, except with less skill and watchability than Lord.

BTW, this isn't directed at you, Pahonu. Just my musings and observations in general. You and I already had this discussion few months back regarding Lord vs. Malden, but I can't see how Mike Connors had greater "range" than Lord. I won't even bother mentioning Mr. Comatose Burr.

Hey Ivan,
I know it’s not directed at me. I enjoy the discussions. Mike Connors and Raymond Burr’s performances were never my favorite either. I do think Conrad was better, though not like Malden, and no where near as entertaining as Garner. I enjoyed David Janssen very much as Harry-O during this time and think he should have been nominated. His costar Anthony Zerbe actually won as supporting actor. It’s all very subjective, obviously. Also, these selections were not based on ratings or the popularity of the show in any way. As I mentioned in my first comment, these are peer awards, directors vote for fellow directors, composers select fellow composers, etc... I can see how difficult personalities, as you said Lord was known to be, might not get recognition by the people they work with. That seems to be at least part of the answer to a lack of any nominations.

[ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan)]

See? That's the thing. Raymond Burr???? Talk about an actor that could make you go comatose. The man sleep-walked through all his roles, whether it was PERRY MASON or IRONSIDE. Mike Connors got nominated for MANNIX too. I don't mind Connors or MANNIX but Lord ran circles around him. Same with Karl Malden on STREETS OF SAN FRANCISCO. He got nominated but he's laughable doing the "tough cop" routine. I really like the show and like him in it but when he was trying to rough up a suspect it was hilarious. He felt like a silly uncle trying to act tough. William Conrad was also nominated for CANNON. What was his gimmick? He was a fat private eye! Seriously, that's it.

The only guy who was in Lord's league (of playing the hard-edged "don't cross me" type) was Telly Savalas playing KOJAK. He actually got nominated and won. The other guys are a joke compared to Lord. Seriously, we can all have our opinions but if you're gonna nominate Connors, Conrad, Malden, Burr (SHUDDER!) then where the heck is Lord's nomination? You're seriously gonna tell me he didn't deserve it but those others did? His show was 10 times more popular and had higher ratings than its peers and as an actor he blew the others away. But hey, if your preference is watching Burr fumbling around in his wheelchair and delivering lines in such a flat manner as to make your eyes glaze over then he's the guy for you. I imagine they nominated him because he probably represented a special interest group - those in wheelchairs? As we all know Lord didn't play the Hollywood game and was not the easiest to get along with. He was a perfectionist every step of the way and being very private he didn't socialize much. I suppose he ruffled some feathers along the way (James Bond/Star Trek) and maybe his peers didn't care for him. But the fact that he was a damn good actor remains and the fact that he didn't get recognized for it is truly unfair! 12 seasons and not a single nomination? You know something isn't right. That's fine if the Emmy's preferred the likes of Peter Falk or James Garner (both fine actors in their roles) because their roles were more animated and quirky, but if that's the case then guys like Mike Connors or William Conrad or Raymond Burr shouldn't have been nominated either because they played those same straight-laced, no-nonsense types that Lord did, except with less skill and watchability than Lord.

BTW, this isn't directed at you, Pahonu. Just my musings and observations in general. You and I already had this discussion few months back regarding Lord vs. Malden, but I can't see how Mike Connors had greater "range" than Lord. I won't even bother mentioning Mr. Comatose Burr.

Hey Ivan,
I know it’s not directed at me. I enjoy the discussions. Mike Connors and Raymond Burr’s performances were never my favorite either. I do think Conrad was better, though not like Malden, and no where near as entertaining as Garner. I enjoyed David Janssen very much as Harry-O during this time and think he should have been nominated. His costar Anthony Zerbe actually won as supporting actor. It’s all very subjective, obviously. Also, these selections were not based on ratings or the popularity of the show in any way. As I mentioned in my first comment, these are peer awards, directors vote for fellow directors, composers select fellow composers, etc... I can see how difficult personalities, as you said Lord was known to be, might not get recognition by the people they work with. That seems to be at least part of the answer to a lack of any nominations.

Pahonu, I actually didn't know that it was peers who nominated their own. I thought it was a special body of "experts" who did the nominating. If Lord was considered persona non grata among them then I guess it makes sense why he never received a nom. I mean it's the ONLY thing that makes sense. Why else would he be snubbed while Burr, Connors, Malden, Conrad and the rest got nominations? As for David Janssen I've never seen HARRY-O but I did see few episodes of THE FUGITIVE and color me unimpressed. Maybe it's just not my cup of tea but he seemed to be sleep-walking through his role. Too low-key for my tastes. But hey, he too was nominated 3 years in a row so again I rest my case about unfair nominations. I suppose since his character is on the run and constantly has to look over his shoulder it makes sense that he would act as low-key and nonchalant as possible. It's just a little too sleep-inducing after a while LOL! Harrison Ford he was not!!

[T.Q.]

Force of Waves - Meh

Highlight - The Oriental nurse.

[Pahonu]

See? That's the thing. Raymond Burr???? Talk about an actor that could make you go comatose. The man sleep-walked through all his roles, whether it was PERRY MASON or IRONSIDE. Mike Connors got nominated for MANNIX too. I don't mind Connors or MANNIX but Lord ran circles around him. Same with Karl Malden on STREETS OF SAN FRANCISCO. He got nominated but he's laughable doing the "tough cop" routine. I really like the show and like him in it but when he was trying to rough up a suspect it was hilarious. He felt like a silly uncle trying to act tough. William Conrad was also nominated for CANNON. What was his gimmick? He was a fat private eye! Seriously, that's it.

The only guy who was in Lord's league (of playing the hard-edged "don't cross me" type) was Telly Savalas playing KOJAK. He actually got nominated and won. The other guys are a joke compared to Lord. Seriously, we can all have our opinions but if you're gonna nominate Connors, Conrad, Malden, Burr (SHUDDER!) then where the heck is Lord's nomination? You're seriously gonna tell me he didn't deserve it but those others did? His show was 10 times more popular and had higher ratings than its peers and as an actor he blew the others away. But hey, if your preference is watching Burr fumbling around in his wheelchair and delivering lines in such a flat manner as to make your eyes glaze over then he's the guy for you. I imagine they nominated him because he probably represented a special interest group - those in wheelchairs? As we all know Lord didn't play the Hollywood game and was not the easiest to get along with. He was a perfectionist every step of the way and being very private he didn't socialize much. I suppose he ruffled some feathers along the way (James Bond/Star Trek) and maybe his peers didn't care for him. But the fact that he was a damn good actor remains and the fact that he didn't get recognized for it is truly unfair! 12 seasons and not a single nomination? You know something isn't right. That's fine if the Emmy's preferred the likes of Peter Falk or James Garner (both fine actors in their roles) because their roles were more animated and quirky, but if that's the case then guys like Mike Connors or William Conrad or Raymond Burr shouldn't have been nominated either because they played those same straight-laced, no-nonsense types that Lord did, except with less skill and watchability than Lord.

BTW, this isn't directed at you, Pahonu. Just my musings and observations in general. You and I already had this discussion few months back regarding Lord vs. Malden, but I can't see how Mike Connors had greater "range" than Lord. I won't even bother mentioning Mr. Comatose Burr.

Hey Ivan,
I know it’s not directed at me. I enjoy the discussions. Mike Connors and Raymond Burr’s performances were never my favorite either. I do think Conrad was better, though not like Malden, and no where near as entertaining as Garner. I enjoyed David Janssen very much as Harry-O during this time and think he should have been nominated. His costar Anthony Zerbe actually won as supporting actor. It’s all very subjective, obviously. Also, these selections were not based on ratings or the popularity of the show in any way. As I mentioned in my first comment, these are peer awards, directors vote for fellow directors, composers select fellow composers, etc... I can see how difficult personalities, as you said Lord was known to be, might not get recognition by the people they work with. That seems to be at least part of the answer to a lack of any nominations.

Pahonu, I actually didn't know that it was peers who nominated their own. I thought it was a special body of "experts" who did the nominating. If Lord was considered persona non grata among them then I guess it makes sense why he never received a nom. I mean it's the ONLY thing that makes sense. Why else would he be snubbed while Burr, Connors, Malden, Conrad and the rest got nominations? As for David Janssen I've never seen HARRY-O but I did see few episodes of THE FUGITIVE and color me unimpressed. Maybe it's just not my cup of tea but he seemed to be sleep-walking through his role. Too low-key for my tastes. But hey, he too was nominated 3 years in a row so again I rest my case about unfair nominations. I suppose since his character is on the run and constantly has to look over his shoulder it makes sense that he would act as low-key and nonchalant as possible. It's just a little too sleep-inducing after a while LOL! Harrison Ford he was not!!

I pulled the quote below from the ATAS website, the Academy of Television Arts & Sciences. It’s the same with the Oscars for AMPAS, which is motion pictures. The only categories that all members vote on is the best film for the Academy Awards, and the best TV drama and comedy series, limited series, TV movies, and variety series. There also different academies for sports, documentaries, and regional and international TV shows.

“Who can vote for the Emmy Awards? The Emmy Award is a symbol of peer recognition. The Academy has over 25,000 members, divided into 30 peer groups of specialized fields. The National Active members of each peer group vote on the nominees and winners for categories pertaining to their area of specialty.”

I don’t think you’re alone in not understanding the process. I worked for a few years in the industry and you quickly understand the various guilds and unions and academy membership details. Most people would have no reason to pay attention to those details. It doesn’t mean that viewers won’t be upset with the choices though! The People’s Choice Awards was created, perhaps for that reason.

[ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan)]

Force of Waves - Meh

Highlight - The Oriental nurse.

I like "Force of Waves" but mostly for the psychological twist where we find out McG's troubled pal (John Vernon) is the baddie. I like that in the end it had absolutely nothing to do with money or divorce or any kinds of business dealings. But something more sinister and twisted. Of course you kinda had to guess that he would be the baddie since Vernon ALWAYS plays baddies and because they wouldn't have him as a guest star only to save McG's life at the beginning and then to just disappear. You had to figure he would play a more vital role.

[ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan)]

Magnum update:

Forgot to mention that I saw "Letter to a Duchess" last week and wasn't too impressed. What impressed me was that many consider it to be a series highlight and even the best from season 4. So far the season highlights for me have been "Home from the Sea" and "Distant Relative". I also enjoyed the first Luther Gillis episode more and even "Limited Engagement" right before this one (if just for the "pickled egg, please" line alone). I guess I like stories where TM is on a case investigating something. Not so much episodes that are just character studies. In any case this episode reminded me too much of season 2's "Tropical Madness" which I thought was a superior episode anyway. And then there's Jane Merrow... she just didn't set right with me. She seemed a bit too "plain Jane" in her looks for Higgy to be so smitten with her.

Since this is Christmas week I look forward to "Operation: Silent Night" which I've never seen! Will report...

[T.Q.]

Magnum update:

Forgot to mention that I saw "Letter to a Duchess" last week and wasn't too impressed. What impressed me was that many consider it to be a series highlight and even the best from season 4. So far the season highlights for me have been "Home from the Sea" and "Distant Relative". I also enjoyed the first Luther Gillis episode more and even "Limited Engagement" right before this one (if just for the "pickled egg, please" line alone). I guess I like stories where TM is on a case investigating something. Not so much episodes that are just character studies. In any case this episode reminded me too much of season 2's "Tropical Madness" which I thought was a superior episode anyway. And then there's Jane Merrow... she just didn't set right with me. She seemed a bit too "plain Jane" in her looks for Higgy to be so smitten with her.

Since this is Christmas week I look forward to "Operation: Silent Night" which I've never seen! Will report...

I'm jelly there are Magnum episodes you've never seen.

[ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan)]

I'm jelly there are Magnum episodes you've never seen.

I'm jammed (LOL!) with these episodes but don't have enough time to just sit down and watch them all.

[ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan)]

I pulled the quote below from the ATAS website, the Academy of Television Arts & Sciences. It’s the same with the Oscars for AMPAS, which is motion pictures. The only categories that all members vote on is the best film for the Academy Awards, and the best TV drama and comedy series, limited series, TV movies, and variety series. There also different academies for sports, documentaries, and regional and international TV shows.

“Who can vote for the Emmy Awards? The Emmy Award is a symbol of peer recognition. The Academy has over 25,000 members, divided into 30 peer groups of specialized fields. The National Active members of each peer group vote on the nominees and winners for categories pertaining to their area of specialty.”

I don’t think you’re alone in not understanding the process. I worked for a few years in the industry and you quickly understand the various guilds and unions and academy membership details. Most people would have no reason to pay attention to those details. It doesn’t mean that viewers won’t be upset with the choices though! The People’s Choice Awards was created, perhaps for that reason.

It's all pretty meaningless then. Mike Connors is buddies with Karl Malden so he nominates him and vice versa, Conrad nominates Burr, etc. No one nominates Lord because "he's strange, difficult to work with, stubborn, etc". It's just a bunch of buddies slapping each other on the backs. The real purpose of these awards is lost. Wasn't there someone who was drunk half the time and still got nominated??

[Pahonu]

I pulled the quote below from the ATAS website, the Academy of Television Arts & Sciences. It’s the same with the Oscars for AMPAS, which is motion pictures. The only categories that all members vote on is the best film for the Academy Awards, and the best TV drama and comedy series, limited series, TV movies, and variety series. There also different academies for sports, documentaries, and regional and international TV shows.

“Who can vote for the Emmy Awards? The Emmy Award is a symbol of peer recognition. The Academy has over 25,000 members, divided into 30 peer groups of specialized fields. The National Active members of each peer group vote on the nominees and winners for categories pertaining to their area of specialty.”

I don’t think you’re alone in not understanding the process. I worked for a few years in the industry and you quickly understand the various guilds and unions and academy membership details. Most people would have no reason to pay attention to those details. It doesn’t mean that viewers won’t be upset with the choices though! The People’s Choice Awards was created, perhaps for that reason.

It's all pretty meaningless then. Mike Connors is buddies with Karl Malden so he nominates him and vice versa, Conrad nominates Burr, etc. No one nominates Lord because "he's strange, difficult to work with, stubborn, etc". It's just a bunch of buddies slapping each other on the backs. The real purpose of these awards is lost. Wasn't there someone who was drunk half the time and still got nominated??

Hey Ivan,

I don’t think it’s anywhere near that simple of an explanation. I believe that most of the members of these groups take their craft seriously, whether directors, writers, editors, or actors. I also believe they honestly look for excellence in their choices. However, and this is a big however, the things they are considering are likely pretty different than what a typical viewer like you and I are thinking about.

By way of example, when we watch a scene, it includes all the various elements of filmmaking put together, which is the point, but those elements can be viewed separately. I don’t mean literally but in how you watch the scene. I have a friend who does a lot of work now as a script doctor. He created a TV series years ago and even directed a feature film in the mid-90’s, which he also wrote. When we talk about films (I was a film major before postgraduate study in history) or TV series, I hear him make comments about things like dialogue or pacing or visuals that I just don’t hear in conversations with other friends talking about the same films. He’s looking for and seeing things that most of us never consider. It’s his career after all.

He is not an actor, but I think the same applies. Imagine we watch a dramatic scene and think that it was fantastic. It may be that the actors performance was good, but perhaps the music really made the impact, or the scenes pacing was intense, or the photography was particularly striking. A composer might feel a certain way about the score, a writer might feel differently about the dialogue or pacing, a cinematographer will have opinions about the photography, and an actor might judge the performance in a very different way. That’s why I think peer awards are important and generally of good quality.

That being said, I think it is also part of human nature to respond to difficult personalities, by not rewarding them. I’m not talking just about Jack Lord here, but if he was very controlling on the set, which I have read a little about, then the other members of the crew will see their creativity limited. That’s not generally appreciated by anyone in any type of creative work. Various directors have reputations in the industry as better or worse to work with as an actor, writer, cinematographer, etc... Some actors have reputations of being difficult as well. I don’t know enough about Jack Lord to say much more than this may have been a part of the reason he received no nominations, but I don’t think this is the only reason why. I know you might disagree, but I still think his relative lack of range in his performance as McGarrett played a role. I find Jack Lord the person far more interesting than the McGarrett character. You might enjoy this:

https://www.metv.com/lists/10-reasons-j ... television

[T.Q.]

Two episodes today doing my weights.

The Late John Louisiana - Yay: spotted Lt. Tanaka

The Last Eden - Hey, that’s Arty Canoe.

You can tell again I love looking for old actors.

Enjoyed both episodes.

[ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan)]

Two episodes today doing my weights.

The Late John Louisiana - Yay: spotted Lt. Tanaka

The Last Eden - Hey, that’s Arty Canoe.

You can tell again I love looking for old actors.

Enjoyed both episodes.

The Late John Louisiana is a great one! Plus Al Harrington as a baddie before he replaced Kono, playing Ben starting with season 5.

The Last Eden is probably the weakest one of the season for me.

[ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan)]

Saw "Operation: Silent Night". NOW we're talking!! Back to form after "Letter to a Duchess". Plus it's Christmas with the entire gang... stranded on a deserted island!!

Loved everything here! Higgy's plane-raft, Rick's fears of the island, TM as Santa Claus, TC's tinkering with the copter. Everyone has something to do and all the interactions are great! The quicksand scene was hilarious - "stand up, Rick" LOL! Also loved Rick trying to tell his secret about his sister, something that he's ashamed of, and never being able to tell it. BTW, it appears to be a different sister, not the one that was killed a few episodes before this. He calls her by a different name. I thought he only had one. Flub?? Also what's the deal with the ship commander (Ed Lauter) proceeding to bomb the hell out of the island even after being told that someone is on the island? I didn't get this part.

But overall, a great Christmas episode and I especially love the ending of the copter in the night sky with the Christmas star shining brightly as the guys sing "Holy Night". This is what I love about shows from long ago! They sure don't make 'em like they used to. Makes me pine for the good old days and takes me back to my childhood - a more innocent time.

Mele Kalikimaka, T.Q. and Pahonu and everyone else who lurks here!

[T.Q.]

Two episodes today doing my weights.

The Late John Louisiana - Yay: spotted Lt. Tanaka

The Last Eden - Hey, that’s Arty Canoe.

You can tell again I love looking for old actors.

Enjoyed both episodes.

The Late John Louisiana is a great one! Plus Al Harrington as a baddie before he replaced Kono, playing Ben starting with season 5.

The Last Eden is probably the weakest one of the season for me.

Nooo.

You should have put a Spoiler Alert on that puppy.

Didn't know Kono leaves the show....

He's become a favourite.

[Pahonu]

Saw "Operation: Silent Night". NOW we're talking!! Back to form after "Letter to a Duchess". Plus it's Christmas with the entire gang... stranded on a deserted island!!

Loved everything here! Higgy's plane-raft, Rick's fears of the island, TM as Santa Claus, TC's tinkering with the copter. Everyone has something to do and all the interactions are great! The quicksand scene was hilarious - "stand up, Rick" LOL! Also loved Rick trying to tell his secret about his sister, something that he's ashamed of, and never being able to tell it. BTW, it appears to be a different sister, not the one that was killed a few episodes before this. He calls her by a different name. I thought he only had one. Flub?? Also what's the deal with the ship commander (Ed Lauter) proceeding to bomb the hell out of the island even after being told that someone is on the island? I didn't get this part.

But overall, a great Christmas episode and I especially love the ending of the copter in the night sky with the Christmas star shining brightly as the guys sing "Holy Night". This is what I love about shows from long ago! They sure don't make 'em like they used to. Makes me pine for the good old days and takes me back to my childhood - a more innocent time.

Mele Kalikimaka, T.Q. and Pahonu and everyone else who lurks here!

Hey Ivan, did you get to see the link buried at the bottom of my previous post about Jack Lord? I think you’ll enjoy it. Happy holidays to you as well.