The Robin Masters Estate (Pahonu)

[Pahonu]

Hi Pahonu,

Sorry if this has been discussed...I couldn't find it through search and I don't see it on your Sketchup. What's this little structure?

Thanks!

~RG

Hi RG,

It's basically a storage shed next to the tennis court. There is a picture of it in here, but I'm not sure of the page.

Thank you, Kenji!

I don't know if that is the storage structure we've all discussed by the tennis court. That structure has a shed roof and is built up against the block wall used for service practice in the corner of the court. That structure looks like a gable roof extending from the same corner of the court but in a different direction. RG, I have the former structure in my model, it's green, but that doesn't seem to match. Maybe it's new. That's a recent photo of the estate with its new green roof. Any thought Kenji?

[Sam]

To me it looks like a pop-up carport.

[Pahonu]

To me it looks like a pop-up carport.

I wouldn't argue. That's as good a guess as anything I could come up with.

[Styles Bitchley]

Interesting to note the parched grassy areas of the estate compared to the neighbours lush green to the west. Is there a water conservation issue on Oahu that may cause this?

[KENJI]

Thanks Sam!
Would a Spanish Colonial have a hinged garage door back then? What do you think Pahonu?
Maybe the garage had a different purpose when it was originally built. We know early on that Eve's grandparents had to take a boat to get there so access there by car was either not possible or very long and dangerous compared to a pleasant boat ride.

Hey Kenji,

Hinged garage doors were still quite common in the 20's and 30's. Early garages were often carriage houses converted for the new technology of the automobile. The problem in the photo is that hinged doors on those columns wouldn't work. The molding at the capital and base would keep any door hinged at the location shown from closing fully. I don't what those "hinges" are but I don't think they were original to the design of the garage based on the columns. For so many years people on the forum have referred to the structure as a maintainance wing or something similar, but I think, given its size and location, it was clearly designed for cars. More of a carport than a fully enclosed garage, though.

Hi Pahonu,

They have me scratching my head as well. A carport rather than a fully enclosed garage was more the norm back then in Hawaii, but what could they be then....I also thought maybe they were the remains of some sort of fancy wrought iron work detail.....just guessing, no idea. Maybe something will come in down the road that will help.

[Styles Bitchley]

Thanks Sam!
Would a Spanish Colonial have a hinged garage door back then? What do you think Pahonu?
Maybe the garage had a different purpose when it was originally built. We know early on that Eve's grandparents had to take a boat to get there so access there by car was either not possible or very long and dangerous compared to a pleasant boat ride.

Hey Kenji,

Hinged garage doors were still quite common in the 20's and 30's. Early garages were often carriage houses converted for the new technology of the automobile. The problem in the photo is that hinged doors on those columns wouldn't work. The molding at the capital and base would keep any door hinged at the location shown from closing fully. I don't what those "hinges" are but I don't think they were original to the design of the garage based on the columns. For so many years people on the forum have referred to the structure as a maintainance wing or something similar, but I think, given its size and location, it was clearly designed for cars. More of a carport than a fully enclosed garage, though.

Hi Pahonu,

They have me scratching my head as well. A carport rather than a fully enclosed garage was more the norm back then in Hawaii, but what could they be then....I also thought maybe they were the remains of some sort of fancy wrought iron work detail.....just guessing, no idea. Maybe something will come in down the road that will help.

Zoomed right in on it, it looks more like a permanent structure than a pop-up car port. You can see two substantial columns at the front. I was actually standing right in front of it when I made my trip to Pahonu in 2008, but I was so busy looking to the right, I didn't notice anything else!

[ConchRepublican]

What caught my eye is the far right (southern side?) side of the Estate, by the Pagoda shaped building on the adjoining property, there's a long structure with a reflective top, maybe glass panels.

Is this the elusive greenhouse?

[308GTS]

Wow, a 100 posts, and this thread is still going strong nearly 7 years on!

[KENJI]

What caught my eye is the far right (southern side?) side of the Estate, by the Pagoda shaped building on the adjoining property, there's a long structure with a reflective top, maybe glass panels.

Is this the elusive greenhouse?

On page 55 of this thread circled in blue you can see the reflective top again.
Pahonu thinks it's the bath house.

At first I thought they might be solar panels, but I'm not thinking that now that I've zoomed in.

What do you think Pahonu? Was it the norm for a Spanish Col. to have skylights in the bath house? It would make it a lot more brighter and inviting in there that's for sure.

[Pahonu]

What caught my eye is the far right (southern side?) side of the Estate, by the Pagoda shaped building on the adjoining property, there's a long structure with a reflective top, maybe glass panels.

Is this the elusive greenhouse?

On page 55 of this thread circled in blue you can see the reflective top again.
Pahonu thinks it's the bath house.

At first I thought they might be solar panels, but I'm not thinking that now that I've zoomed in.

What do you think Pahonu? Was it the norm for a Spanish Col. to have skylights in the bath house? It would make it a lot more brighter and inviting in there that's for sure.

Hey Conch,

I haven't had a chance to congratulate you on all the cool stuff you've been doing with CoziTV. Great job!

Sadly, unlike the show, the estate seems never to have actually had a greenhouse. According to the tax records, it once had a lath house, which would look quite a bit different.

Hey Kenji,

Your right, I've said in previous posts that it is the bath/shower facility mentioned by a visitor to the estate attending one of it's public functions, such as the pug meeting. I can't see it being original to the estate. It might even be post-Magnum filming so it probably has nothing to do with the original Spanish Colonial style. I think it was built after the mainhouse began falling into disrepair as a way to host functions on the grounds and in the tidepool, but not have all the guests go into the main house. That's about all the estate is used for these days, it seems. The shiny things on top look like skylights or vents like you might see in public bathrooms at the beach.

[KENJI]

Hey Kenji,

Your right, I've said in previous posts that it is the bath/shower facility mentioned by a visitor to the estate attending one of it's public functions, such as the pug meeting. I can't see it being original to the estate. It might even be post-Magnum filming so it probably has nothing to do with the original Spanish Colonial style. I think it was built after the mainhouse began falling into disrepair as a way to host functions on the grounds and in the tidepool, but not have all the guests go into the main house. That's about all the estate is used for these days, it seems. The shiny things on top look like skylights or vents like you might see in public bathrooms at the beach.[/quote]

Thanks Pahonu.

It would be great to come up with a huge list of questions (or even just a few) about Pahonu and get a realtor to find out the answers for us.
What is that concrete slab in the tidal pond........ can you tell me if the bath house is original to the house....was Pahonu ever larger than the 3 acres.....etc.,etc.

[Pahonu]

Thanks Pahonu.

It would be great to come up with a huge list of questions (or even just a few) about Pahonu and get a realtor to find out the answers for us.
What is that concrete slab in the tidal pond........ can you tell me if the bath house is original to the house....was Pahonu ever larger than the 3 acres.....etc.,etc.

That's a really good idea. I wonder if Ms. Anderson knows the answers to any of the above.

[KENJI]

Thanks Pahonu.

It would be great to come up with a huge list of questions (or even just a few) about Pahonu and get a realtor to find out the answers for us.
What is that concrete slab in the tidal pond........ can you tell me if the bath house is original to the house....was Pahonu ever larger than the 3 acres.....etc.,etc.

That's a really good idea. I wonder if Ms. Anderson knows the answers to any of the above.

I'm sure she will know many of the answers and this will probably be our only chance at finding out a few of them via a realtor/Eve.
I bet she also has some very old photo albums of Pahonu from 1930s etc either sitting on a shelf or tucked away in a box! I know we are not going to see those images, but we might get a few answers.

[ThomasMagnum]

I was watching HF0 yesterday and I got the glimpse of the gatehouse so I took some photos




Also, in the episode they show what is meant to be the estate's kitchen. Is it?



It's a shame the estate isn't registered - My understanding is that there are 2 registers: a National Register and a State Register.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_ ... gs_in_Oahu

There are 151 buildings in Oahu that are part of the Register. When you look at a few of them, its hard to believe that Pahonu isn't among them (e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boettcher_Estate). Having said that, this should have been done 30 years ago.

I see that Spalding House/HMoA is listed (Echoes of the Mind). Registered in 1972.

Eligibility criteria:

Any individual can prepare a National Register nomination, although historians and historic preservation consultants often are employed for this work. The nomination consists of a standard nomination form and contains basic information about a property's physical appearance and the type of significance embodied in the building, structure, object, site, or district. The State Historic Preservation Office receives National Register nominations and provides feedback to the nominating individual or group. After preliminary review, the SHPO sends each nomination to the state's historic review commission, which then recommends whether the State Historic Preservation Officer should send the nomination to the Keeper of the National Register. For any non-Federally owned property, only the State Historic Preservation Officer may officially nominate a property for inclusion in the National Register. After the nomination is recommended for listing in the National Register by the SHPO, the nomination is sent to the National Park Service, which approves or denies the nomination. If approved, the property is entered officially by the Keeper of the National Register into the National Register of Historic Places. Property owners are notified of the nomination during the review by the SHPO and state's historic review commission. If an owner objects to a nomination of private property, or in the case of a historic district, a majority of owners, then the property cannot be listed in the National Register of Historic Places.

Criteria

For a property to be eligible for the National Register, it must meet at least one of the four National Register main criteria. Information about architectural styles, association with various aspects of social history and commerce, and ownership are all integral parts of the nomination. Each nomination contains a narrative section that provides a detailed physical description of the property and justifies why it is significant historically with regard either to local, state, or national history. The four National Register of Historic Places criteria are the following.

Criterion A, "Event," the property must make a contribution to the major pattern of American history.
Criterion B, "Person," is associated with significant people of the American past.
Criterion C, "Design/Construction," concerns the distinctive characteristics of the building by its architecture and construction, including having great artistic value or being the work of a master.
Criterion D, "Information potential," is satisfied if the property has yielded or may be likely to yield information important to prehistory or history.

The criteria are applied differently for different types of properties; for instance, maritime properties have application guidelines different from those of buildings.

Exclusions

There are specific instances where properties usually do not merit listing in the National Register. As a general rule, cemeteries, birthplaces, graves of historical figures, properties owned by religious institutions or used for religious purposes, moved structures, reconstructed historic buildings, commemorative properties, and properties that have achieved significance during the last fifty years are not qualified for listing on the Register. There are, however, exceptions to all the preceding; mitigating circumstances allow properties classified in one of those groups to be included.

This may sound crazy but.... We could enter a nomination?

(Since the wrecking ball is on the cards I'd rather die trying)

[ThomasMagnum]

Wow... Shangri La isn't listed

here's a map of all (most) registered buildings in Oahu (I think it may be missing a few - last updated in 2010)

https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8 ... dg=feature