Memories Are Forever (1) (2.5)

[Vxc961]

Thanks ENSHealy!

I considered the 1975 evac, but while it solves one problem (the SWO pin being issued/authorized), to me it creates a few more. If the Magnum/TC/Rick/Michelle scene takes place in 1975, shortly before the April fall of Saigon, it seems really odd that all three of them would be out on the town, in uniform (especially dress uniforms). Since their VMO2 was sort of a secret-squirrel unit, I can buy that maybe they were doing some sneaky stuff after the US military pullout in 1973, but it would almost certainly be a "low-vis" situation, not one where they'd get together in their finest military uniforms. I suppose it's possible that the restaurant was actually in another part of Indochina (ie, VMO2 set up a base in Laos, Cambodia, or Thailand), but it still just rubs me the wrong way. I'm still leaning toward him wearing it as an unofficial pin, and having some nostalgia for it after the war as evidenced by his belt buckle. I feel like it sort of fits with Magnum sort of thumbing his nose at "the man" by wearing the SWO pin before it was official. If he was out in town and caught by, say, Buck Greene, I can totally see him saying "maybe I am out of uniform Col Greene? What are you going to do about it, send me to Vietnam?"

If I imagine that VMO2 was pulled out with the rest of the military in 1973, it also seems a bridge too far to think that all three guys would make it back to help out with the evacuation. After pulling out of Vietnam, VMO2 would likely have a lot of retirements, resignations, reassignments and transfers. I can imagine Magnum finagling his way to get back and help with the evac, but I can't see his VMO2 sticking together and all three getting sent back to help.

It's funny how seeing that SWO pin, and later the SEAL trident, has raised so many questions for me!

I've also thought a bit more about about Magnum's ribbons, and his lack of a combat action ribbon. I think if VMO2 was really such a hush-hush unit, "big Navy" probably wouldn't have a record of Magnum being in a combat zone. Granted, he could certainly submit a copy of his Navy Cross or Purple Heart, or probably mention the three months he did has a POW (if I remember season three well enough!), but never did. I think we've seen that Magnum chafes a bit under rules, regulations and paperwork, so for him it probably wasn't worth it for him to ever submit for his combat action ribbon or any other award.

Well, the amount I've talked about VMO2, SEAL and SWO insignia probably gives you an idea of what I thought of this episode! I love the lore, and how it paints the picture of our main characters as having gone through so much together and how that still bonds them today. I can see how the Michelle story might be a little flimsy (as mentioned, he has a Top Secret clearance but married the wife of an NVA officer????), but I was so into the story that I could look past it.

I'm anxious to dissect Rick, TC, Mac and Col Greene's chest candy now. I hope I can find some good screen caps of them!

[ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan)]

I can see how the Michelle story might be a little flimsy (as mentioned, he has a Top Secret clearance but married the wife of an NVA officer????), but I was so into the story that I could look past it.

But Magnum didn't marry the wife of an NVA officer. He married an unmarried girl named Michelle. General Hue wasn't in the picture until after TM was stateside and Michelle thought he was dead. So it's the NVA officer who married an American soldier's wife. Not the other way around.

[Vxc961]

Are you sure Ivan? I’ll watch again, but I’m pretty sure the reasoning she didn’t look up or get back with Magnum was because she married the general first. I remember Col Greene saying Michelle thought the general was dead, married Magnum, but then “as a good Catholic” when she found out the general was alive, she felt her marriage to Magnum wasn’t valid (and presumably couldn’t divorce him as a good Catholic).

I’ll have to rewatch the episodes and see if I’m remembering it wrong.

[Vxc961]

In part 2, after Magnum gets caught trying to sneak into NIA, there’s a scene with General Hue and then a scene with Mac driving Col Greene and Magnum (who have all changed into civies—where did Magnum get the clothes?), and Col Greene explains it. Michelle thought Hue died during the Tet Offensive. She found out Hue was alive as “we” were pulling out of Vietnam, but didn’t tell Magnum because she knew that Magnum wouldn’t leave, and Michelle no longer considered their marriage valid since her husband was still alive.

[ENSHealy]

So my question has always been, how does the supposed widow of an NVA officer become a nurse in a Saigon hospital? One would think she would have stayed in the North, even after she thought Hue was dead.

[ZelenskyTheValiant (Ivan)]

In part 2, after Magnum gets caught trying to sneak into NIA, there’s a scene with General Hue and then a scene with Mac driving Col Greene and Magnum (who have all changed into civies—where did Magnum get the clothes?), and Col Greene explains it. Michelle thought Hue died during the Tet Offensive. She found out Hue was alive as “we” were pulling out of Vietnam, but didn’t tell Magnum because she knew that Magnum wouldn’t leave, and Michelle no longer considered their marriage valid since her husband was still alive.

Ah ok, so maybe I'm the one that's misremembering.

[Vxc961]

It’s pretty convoluted, so I think you can be excused. She thinks Hue died and then lives a completely different life, which is kind of what happens to Magnum too.

She’s catholic, educated, and part French (I assume?); generally I’d say she would come off as bourgeois elite. It seems particularly odd that she’d be attracted to Hue, or that marrying her would do anything for his career.

I have a family member who served as an advisor with ARVN. He goes to the (resettled in the US) reunions now. It’s full of ARVN soldiers who spent 5-10 years in communist “re-education” camps, generally proportional to their ranks. I can’t see communist North Vietnam just looking the other way with Michelle.

[Tuan Vu from Hawaii]

Another great two-parter. So great to see these two episodes again after 40 years (gosh, I am getting really old!). It brought back memories of when I lived in Hawaii. It was fun to see St. Andrew's Cathedral, the Falls of Clyde, Chinatown, the YWCA building and the Hawaii State Capital. I used to see the lighting equipment, vans, tents and set up the show used during filming back in the day when I happened to work downtown. They often cornered off portions of downtown Honolulu during filming, but I never actually saw any stars/actors or any actual filming because I was always too busy. Still, it's pretty cool seeing those places and remembering them as they were. Seems like a lifetime ago!

[Aloha Friday]

Just watching this one after a long while of avoiding it. All of the Michelle episodes were somewhat sad and depressing, so I tend to skip over them. But, the various occupational badges make a good discussion. My guess is neither the Surface Warfare or SEAL badges existed when TM entered the Navy and he served several years before they were issued. He was probably qualified to wear either or both. What I found interesting was TM left the service as an O-3 (Lieutenant) but recalled as an O-5 (Commander). In Season 6, Solo Flight, He is wearing a jungle fatigue blouse with O-4 rank on it. He never served in that rank...if there were any consistency in the storyline. Still the best TV series...ever!

[waverly2211]

Just watching this one after a long while of avoiding it. All of the Michelle episodes were somewhat sad and depressing, so I tend to skip over them. But, the various occupational badges make a good discussion. My guess is neither the Surface Warfare or SEAL badges existed when TM entered the Navy and he served several years before they were issued. He was probably qualified to wear either or both. What I found interesting was TM left the service as an O-3 (Lieutenant) but recalled as an O-5 (Commander). In Season 6, Solo Flight, He is wearing a jungle fatigue blouse with O-4 rank on it. He never served in that rank...if there were any consistency in the storyline. Still the best TV series...ever!

The Seal Trident medal was first issued in 1970, Gold for officers and Silver for enlisted.